By: Zatch Pouchprom
Lyoto Machida’s unanimous decision victory over Mauricio Rua was a lot of things. It was ugly, It was hard fought, It was close, but, the one thing it was not was wrong. Everything about this fight was controversial, from the ringside commentary to the supposedly “stunning” decision. It seems everyone who watched this fight has a strong opinion about it one way or the other. The MMA community has been raging over the merits of the judges’ decision since it was first handed down and the debate hasn’t stopped.
The fact is, this was a fight that was colored more by the ringside commentary than by the action going on inside the octagon. From the opening moments, Rua unleashed a consistent flow of Muay Thai leg kicks that didn’t stop until the final bell. Those leg kicks were vicious, hard and damaging. They were also the only offense Shogun was able to mount all night. While no one can deny the effective precision of Rua’s leg kicks, it is also true that they did not put Machida on the canvas one time during any of the five rounds of the fight. Nor did the leg kicks damage Machida’s leg movement enough to allow Shogun to score a take down at any point in the match.
For his part Machida absorbed a tremendous amount of punishment to his legs, but at the same time was able to launch effective counter punches that seemed to go unnoticed by the announce team of Joe Rogan and Mike Goldberg. Consistently throughout the fight, Rua’s crisp Muay Thai leg strikes were met with a straight left or right hands by Machida that would send Rua back-peddling from the engagement. Interestingly, just as consistently, Rogan and Goldberg seem to comment only Rua’s part of the exchange in excited and laudatory tones. So it appears that while the ringside commentators that night were failing to see Machida’s counter-attacks, the ringside judges did see them and scored them accordingly.
The amount of outrage that has followed this fight seems to fall upon the theme that this was a one-sided matter, with Rua striking and battering Machida at will with no response from the champ. If the fight the commentators described that night had actually taken place in the ring then that would certainly be the case. Yet, that simply is not what happened and the commentary provided that night covered only one side of the match.
Throughout the fight, Rua at no time was able to follow up on his effective leg kicks or at any time put Machida in any real danger. Instead, most of his kicks where countered by Machida with hard straight lefts and rights up the middle that caught Rua on a consistent basis. Furthermore, Shogun’s limited attempts at a takedown were also defended and rebuffed. Interestingly, the only pressing flurries which seemed to put anyone in danger occurred when Machida pressed the action in the latter part of round 3 and unleashed a flurry of punches pinning Rua against the cage before the round ended.
Machida and the judges have taken a lot of heat over the decision since the fight. The myth of the of the Rua dominated victory being “stolen” out of his hands by the judges has taken root in the popular consciousness of most in the MMA community, even if that account has no basis in fact. That is thanks, in no small part, to the one-sided hyperbole from the announce team. When one thinks that at no time did Rua press Machida or take him down in the match, after repeated attempts, it becomes very difficult to reconcile those facts with the supposed “domination” by Rua.
Commentary aside. This fight was very close between two very skilled mixed martial artists. Rua’s leg kicks would have eventually overtaken Machida if the fight had lasted another round or two. But scoring it on the 10 point must system per round, as the CSAC judges were required to do, it is clear that the unanimous decision was not only legitimate but warranted. The fight described by the announce team was one-sided and the decision inexcusable. The fight that actually occurred in the octagon on October 24, 2009 for the UFC Light-Heavyweight Championship was close, hard fought and fairly won by the champion.
Tags: lyoto machida, shogun rua, showgun rua, ufc 104, 료토마치다
November 6th, 2009 at 3:05 pm
This is a great summary of the obvious truth as seen by three professional, well qualified judges who were the closest to the action of anyone. Its just unfortunate that so many MMA “fans”, many of whom have never fought in thier entire lives, refuse to recognise it.
November 6th, 2009 at 5:45 pm
I am really glad that you mentioned the lopsided commentary by the mouseketeer announce squad and UFC management. The fight was indeed very painful to watch, but it was NOT even close to being the amazing Rua feat that those geniuses at UFC and other pseudo-fans indicated! Lyoto Machida won the match through perseverance, intelligence, and dedication to his dream. I really wonder if the judges were the only ones there who were paying attention throughout the entire fight?
November 6th, 2009 at 8:18 pm
the thing is very simple, most of mma fans are used to see the muay thai fighting system, they are not familiarized with karate style of fighting: anticipation, counter atacks, long distance, avoid beeing hit. every box system (kick boxing, box, muay thai, sanshou, etc) consists in a exchange of blows, karate its diferent, it consists in accuracy and effectiveness, so mma fans are used to see people gettin hit and beeing damaged by kick in the leg o a lot of punches to the face, so while they were watching rua, its obviously that they thought that he won because they dont know karate, its not the best marcial art, but its prooving to bes the most effective.
November 6th, 2009 at 9:13 pm
The author described what I saw and felt perfectly!
November 6th, 2009 at 9:24 pm
Lyoto Machida is a True champion !!
Go lyoto !!
November 6th, 2009 at 10:16 pm
I agree. I am a shotokan karateka of 24 years. He represents traditional karate very well and deserves to be the champion. The rematch will prove this undoubtably.
November 7th, 2009 at 12:30 am
I was thinking the exact same thing. I’m glad that someone pointed out that people watching at home from TV are watching through a VERY biased lens. Mike Goldberg and Joe Rogan are great commentators and I laugh a lot at what Joe Rogan says because he is hilarious but he isn’t qualified to be a judge. Viewers are affected by the commentary and the replays and the slow-mo angles that they choose to show and it might not be an accurate depiction of the fight. I’m a big fan of Lyoto and I was very disappointed in his showing, and in my opinion I think he lost 3-2 but again that means nothing. I’m glad that both fighters will have another chance to go at it again. The rematch will be incredible and incredibly hyped up, and I’m hoping for a decisive decision between two well-matched fighters.
November 7th, 2009 at 12:38 am
I was also thinking while watching the fight live that it was possible that the first few rounds could go to Machida if the judges thought that they were almost even and were reluctant to give him his first ever loss in a round if it was so close. Not that it’s fair …
November 7th, 2009 at 1:03 am
Zatch, Are you serious? What fight did you watch? I noticed you stated that Machida defended all Shogun’s takedown attempts. This might be true but how maney takedowns did Machita attempt? I have observed the fight several times and I have not noticed either fighter ever being in danger at any point during the fight.
Im not a Shogun fan or Machida fan. Im a MMA fan and after observing the fight several times I dont know why people are upset. This question goes for both sides. Look! the way I see it the fans got to watch a great fight. For once both fighter were evenly matched and that fight could have went either way. If Shogun and Machida dont like the judges or commentary decesion then they need to finish the fight before it gios that far.
I can’t wait for the rematch so I can watch another great fight. Good luck to both fighters.
November 7th, 2009 at 1:10 am
great summary, exactly what i have been stating to all my friends down here in sydney australia….
November 7th, 2009 at 3:29 am
i dont know what all those mma are complaining about…it was a good fight..not the greatest…but still good…and i also thought that watching it on tv did make it seem one sided…i watched the fight carefully and i never paid attention to rogan or goldberg…they are just their to hype things up…i dont even know why they have commentators…i mean come on we’re not stupid…we can see whats going on..why the hell do we need two retards to repeat whats going on?…rogan sounds so stupid sometimes..he doesnt even know what hes talking about…i personally thought this fight was too close to call…i wasnt impressed by either fighter…i dont even know why shogun was crying like a little girl after the fight…i mean if he wanted to be champion so bad he should of fought harder and won decisively…being the challenger he had more to prove…and he just wasnt able to pull it off…even though he landed those legs kicks they didnt do much damage to machida…he wasnt limping or anything…he was rocked however by machidas punches…bottom line i wasnt impressed by either fighter…machida is the champ and he defended his belt…rua didnt do sh*t..he didnt fight hard enough..he did not impress..he didnt deserve to win at all
November 7th, 2009 at 7:13 am
I’m sorry but shogun pushed the fight and yes he didn’t take machida down but at least he tried.If it wasnt for shogun there would be no fight.No one is ever going to knock machida out because he fights with defense.The only way is by score cards. The crowd wasn’t listning to Joe and almost all where upset.Shogun looked like the bully and machida the kid on the run.
November 7th, 2009 at 11:02 am
The best article yet!
November 7th, 2009 at 11:33 am
I dont agree.
Shogon won the figth 4 rounds
Dana is rigth
November 7th, 2009 at 1:14 pm
if lyoto had done a raise the leg he wouldn’t be damage on their legs like the muay thai defense knee.
November 8th, 2009 at 1:56 am
i totally agree with this article. joe rogan was obviously one-sided when he kept mentioning abt shogun’s offenses but fail to mention about machida’s. vicious hits won’t always score you more points.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:19 am
all doubts will be put to rest when the dragon knocks out shogun on their rematch.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:27 am
i hope lyoto stays undefeated. he is a true champion. if we have a manny pacquiao here in the philippines, in belem they have lyoto machida. i hope the fight with shogun taught lyoto a great lesson very early about handling the instant fame and attention, i know in the rematch lyoto will put a better performance and knock shogun out.
November 8th, 2009 at 11:11 am
I believe Machida won the fight though it was close. This article gives a good description why so. Plus it is up to the challanger to prove he is better without a doubt and he didn’t. He was tacticles with the kicks but it didn’t work well enough to allow him to take full control. Lyoto stopped shogun from take downs. THis means lyoto had the octagon control by keeping it standing up. He also was trying more for a knock out finish in my opion then shogun. When ever lyoto would open up on shogun and press forward shogun would cover up and back up where as lyoto at least tried to counter when shogun attacked. Many times Shogun had left himself open for body kicks but lyoto was trying to give the fans the show by using more head attackes with his hands. Though Machida won it was not his best performance. It looked like he lacked consintration that he usally has. A rematch will show lyotos true dominace in the octagon now that he is getting use to the attention that comes with being a champ. I believe that this is more of a threat then shoguns actual striking.
November 8th, 2009 at 4:22 pm
Anybody whos knows anything about mma will clearly agree that Machida won. Like you said in this blog that he countered all the leg kicks with punches is what I would of scored as well. Not once did I see Machida in any trouble that says that shogun should be champion. But I did see shogun against the cage eating punches and kicks and was almost all over for him. He also tried to take Machida to the ground and looked like a little 8 year old boy trying to take down his father and was unsuccessful. Everybody should watch the fight again and count the leg kicks thrown by shogun and the counter punches and kicks thrown by Machida. Then maybe real followers will see that Machida is champ. Rampage you are so dumb. The more you talk the more you sound like a retard. good decision to quit ufc. If I fought like you i would quit too. Machida good luck in your future. You are the best fighter I have ever seen.
November 9th, 2009 at 12:26 am
RUA was better,,hey lyoto ,,u lost that fight,,
fucking dana white,,UFC is a joke..
November 9th, 2009 at 1:37 am
nachida dominates the whole fight by his counter attack../….
November 9th, 2009 at 1:38 am
Yeah, I agree that the commentary sucked. They did not see the counter punches thrown by Machida. Both men, Machida and Rua had a fair share of receiving kicks on the ribs. And most of the time, this was not seen by Joe Rogan and Mike Golberg, the kicks thrown by Rua was being blocked by Machida’s arm. They (Rogan and Golberg) should have seen it if they were real fighters or had an experience fighting in the ring.
I would like to share this link “http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYOlwn-ybdI”
Lyoto can add this counterkick (spinning hook kick or he can vary it to a spinning back kick or even a spinning back fist)to his arsenal. This is from the open stance…
November 10th, 2009 at 4:54 am
Joe Rogan and Mike Goldberg should practice and enhance more their professionalism and not be one sided on the bouts. They should learn to respect the well trained judges and the two of them are only announcers and commentators. Before Joe Rogan and Mike Goldberg gave any negative comments to the champion they should ask the judges and interview the judges first or else the UFC will fall because of these two big shame guys. I want to see Joe Rogan nd Mike goldberg Fight in the octagon and lets see if they can do anything if they will compete against Lyoto Machida. The Dragon remains the Dragon and have not been beaten yet and knockout or even hit by a solid punch or kick to the face.
November 10th, 2009 at 9:20 am
shame on Rogan and Goldberg….I watched every fight of the Dragon and didnt see any solid punch or kick in his face at all.
after he knocks out rua at the rematch i want to see him eating rampage!!!
November 10th, 2009 at 11:06 am
I think rua did an excelent job in this fight cause he fought a totally different game then he ever has befor but he didnt turn up the pressure enough in the final round so he lost. I love but of these fighters and am excited for the rematch but the i think next fight the old rua will show up and machida should ko him. Machida is the greatest fighter in mma history imo he just had a rough night
November 10th, 2009 at 7:59 pm
The fight looked pretty even to me. I faulted both fighters for not pressing more in the 4th and 5th rounds when the fight seemed to be on the line.
As for those so-called announcers: I think they were looking for their own payday with a Rua vs Silva matchup. Dana would have probably given them a big bonus. I also noticed, as did others, that the Dana entourage seemed to be cheering for Rashad in his fight with Machida.
Anyway, Machida is and will continue to be my favorite fighter – a class act all the way. Go Dragon!
November 11th, 2009 at 12:48 am
Regardless of who I think won the fight, that performance has to concern Machida and his fans.
Machida beat Rashad Evans because effectively, Rashad could not hit him.
Yet, Shogun landed far too many kicks on Machida. Why did Lyoto let that happen? Lyoto’s strategy of NOT GETTING HIT got him where he is – and we see what happens when he deviates.
November 11th, 2009 at 6:08 am
Lyoto won the fight – the commentators were clearly on Shogun’s side – but I have watched the fight over & over again to study the form – and Lyoto won the fight..Period.
November 11th, 2009 at 9:58 am
The commentary was terrible and one sided. I’ve studied Shotokan Karate for 15 years and Lyoto fought a smart, consistent fight against a tough opponent.
Lyoto did the right thing and didn’t get impatient. Damage was delivered on both sides and both fighters were well aware of the dangers of taking chances.
When you have two very skilled fighters, it’s a chess match and fans needs to understand that. I’ve seen many people in Shotokan fights get impatient or overly aggressive and get knocked out. Better to win by decision than suffer repeated brain injuries
I think Lyoto could use some of those sweeps his father taught him to negate the leg kicks from Shogun. Sweep the back leg, reverse punch on the way down. (Easier said than done)
Anyways, both Lyoto and Shogun have my complete respect. They are great martial artists with humility and respect for one another.
November 11th, 2009 at 10:10 am
Good and accurate article here, the fight was very close, but the champ deserved the win in the end.
November 11th, 2009 at 11:14 am
No doubt, Lyoto is the champ. He is a great fighter as he is 16-0 so far. Go Lyoto.
November 11th, 2009 at 10:14 pm
I lost my respect for Machida. Not only is he arrogant about what was clearly a loss, now his website is posting an article about how he WON the fight. Funny, 95% of the other articles about this fight went the other way… weird. And to all the people who still support this chump you’re just making it harder on yourselves when Shogun beats Machida… again.
November 11th, 2009 at 11:49 pm
i believe that the match was very close. perhaps close to a draw. maybe machida does deserve that small margin by which he won. anyhow, both machida and rua are great fighters, and a rematch ought to clear up things. anyway, the match commentatory was very one-sided, and proved to be the cause of the fan’s reactions. however, there is no lack of people who think that either machida won, or it was a draw.
November 12th, 2009 at 10:18 pm
An objective student of the (fighting) game who has knowledge of traditional martial arts can appreciate Machida karate. Most MMA fans are only familiar with BJJ and Muay Thai, thus are less likely to understand the (sometimes subtle) tactics employed by Machida. “Failure is the key to success” (Morihei Ueshiba – founder of aikido) and I believe Machida failed to make the adjustments to counter the leg kicks. That being said, this fight will only make Machida a better and very successful fighter.
If it was a dominant performance by Rua as suggested by many fans, fighters, and so-called pundits then it doesn’t say much for Mauricio. Rua chose to throw leg kicks without following up with any punch/kick combinations. If Machida employed this tactic I can only imagine what would be said. Was Rua the more aggressive fighter? Well if going forward is the definition then perhaps he was. However it was Machida who initiated the striking and flurries which are better characterizations of being aggressive. Kudos should go to Machida for pressing the fight as Rua was content with his one kick to the leg strategy. Rua failed to take down Machida after chopping down his legs – would you call this a dominant showing by Rua? Some say that the end of the fight said it all, i.e. Machida was cut and bruised while Rua looked relatively good. Alas, looks can be deceiving – just look at Fedor’s face after his fight with Brett Rogers (who looked quite well). One would think Rogers won the fight, but it was Fedor who KO Rogers. Let the fickle fans jump on the Rua bandwagon…they’ll jump off as soon as he loses (again). In the end Rua has only himself and his entourage to blame. Why didn’t he finish the fight if he was so dominant? The rhetoric and whining stemming from Machida’s victory has become tedious and passé. It’s time to move on. The Machida Era continues.
November 13th, 2009 at 12:10 pm
bravo pas besoin d’etre specialiste en mma ni juge pour voir que tu as domine les 3 premiers rounds et que tu t es relaché au dernier .tanks for your karate j attend la revanche j’espere que tu gagnera .
November 14th, 2009 at 6:38 am
Lyoto, Go & Knock em ALL
Hit the Jaws and Pull their Teeth
Seek & Destroy with a Motorbreath
Like a Sweep Phantom make them Fall
Make em Whiplashed and Knock em All
Go, Lyoto.
November 14th, 2009 at 10:47 am
Not only am I a martial artist myself who has been training in various styles for 22 years, whom has a black belt in Shotokan Karate (5.5 years of training in this style), but I was also at the LA Staples Center that night, in attendance with my girlfriend. Having seen the fight with my own two eyes and without any audio swaying from announcers, etc., I saw a very close match, but one that Lyoto Machida did ultimately win.
I’m not biased either as to one fighting style, because in addition to being a black belt under 8th Dan Hiroyasu Fujishima and 10th Dan Kanazawa (Shotokan), I’ve equal background in wrestling, TaeKwonDo, kickboxing, and JiuJitsu. I have trained in some other artstyles as well, but those are my most prominent.
May the best fighter win, hopefully at UFC 109: Machida vs. Rua II / Lesnar vs. Carwin. That would be an amazing night. Get better Lyoto, train intelligently, and come back better than you thought you could ever be.
- Paul Gale
November 14th, 2009 at 7:54 pm
After all the hype I saw and controversy surrounding the decision, I expected to see Shogun “clearly the winner” as many others are saying. Instead, I watched this video and saw Machida get the better hits, and never in any trouble. I agree that Shogun obviously studied Lyoto’s style and had a plan, but I think his plan only worked to keep him alive for all 5 rounds. In no way should anybody think that Shogun deserves the title holder after a showing like that. It was a close fight via decision, but the decision was correct and I’m not sure why anyone would have an argument against the decision after seeing the fight video myself (and replaying parts that the announcers seemed to think Shogun was getting the hits when in fact Lyoto was getting better hits).
November 15th, 2009 at 6:22 pm
Lyoto and all you out there siding with him are idiot’s for not recognizing that he lost to Shogun. Everyone in that arena knew, the whole entire world saw that Lyoto had lost. Of course he is going to say that he won to protect his belt and reputation, I mean come on Shogun was more aggressive and you can tell each time Lyoto got hit. I’m not saying that he didn’t do his share of damage , but Shogun output more and YOU all know it!”and some fellow cage fighters such as BJ Penn, Kenny Florian, Joe Stevenson, Rickson Gracie, and Frank Trigg felt that Shogun won the fight”, Quote taken from a UFC postfight article so all of you out there saying if you haven’t fought don’t talk these are professionals saying that Shogun had won. So STFU Lyoto is over rated, and Shogun should have had the belt in his hands.
November 16th, 2009 at 11:05 am
OSU!!!!!!!!
November 16th, 2009 at 2:45 pm
This is very well written.
Just because Shogun was more offensive doesen’t mean he was controlling the match!
Everytime he kicked Lyoto in the ribs he got a stiff punch in the face!
Was this a close match? Sure.
Comparing the fighters appearance and the way they looked after the match, did Shogun LOOK like the winner? Sure.
And was Lyoto the fair winner? Yes!
November 16th, 2009 at 6:51 pm
Lyoto,
You would have gained considerably more respect (and notariety) if you’d just admitted that you were not the better fighter that night. Other nights, definitely yes. But not that night. Shogun showed up. I have watched the footage over and over and there is no possible way the scoring was done ‘correctly”. Be real.
Losing respect.
November 17th, 2009 at 12:23 am
The Dragon won the fight by wining the 3 rounds out 5, the commentators were biased, the griefers STFU.
November 17th, 2009 at 7:57 pm
Counters and effective defense have always been Machida’s winning strategy. How are any of you people surprised (or for that matter disturbed) by the fact that it has worked once again? Is it not enough that Shogun has been the one person to really challenge him and with little more than some leg kicks? If I had to choose between some hard kicks, and some intelligent counter punches…guess what?
Get over it, there’s a rematch, and I get the feeling they both want to put an end to this crap more decisively for those of you who are visually or mentally challenged.
November 19th, 2009 at 2:54 pm
IT IS EASY TO TALK CRAP ABOUT THIS FIGHT BUT THE POINT REMAINS.MACHIDA IS THE BETTER FIGHTER.WHY ? BECAUSE HE HAS MORE SKILLS AND A BETTER FIGHT STYLE. RUA LOOKED GOOD BUT HE COULDNT FOLLOW THROUGH.THE DRAGON IS JUST BEGINING TO SHOW HIS SKILLS.WATCH AND LEARN ALL YOU WANNA BE FIGHTERS..THE BEST IS YET TO COME…..
THANKS FOR LISTENING A.M.P. SANDAN
U.S.A.URBAN GOJU
November 19th, 2009 at 4:20 pm
Machida rules! But let me tell you this Rua is the first one to actually bruise Machida body. Rua couldn’t win though because of Machida style. Even Rashad couldn’t get Machida… Case Close!
November 19th, 2009 at 4:24 pm
Who do you think gonna fight Machida next Tito Ortiz or Forrest Griffin. Tito had his chance to beat Machida but he failed. Maybe Forrest will get another shot for the title. It won’t be easy to fight Machida, I mean he not like Anderson Silva…Even though he lost against him too.
November 21st, 2009 at 10:18 pm
It was a close fight points wise, but I couldn’t agree more that Lyoto won the fight.
November 23rd, 2009 at 2:07 am
Right on– finally an unbiased account of the fight! It was a close tough battle, but Rogan and his hand puppet Goldberg would have the viewer believing Rua was destroying Machida with ‘devastating leg kicks!’ Rogan just wanted to say ‘Shogun!!’ ‘Shogun!! ‘Shogun!! no matter what Machida did– just as the article states. Machida could have knocked Rua down with a strike and Rogan would have screamed “Great LANDING by Shogun!, Mike- he even had a great counter leg kick on the way down!” followed by Goldberg “Thats why Shoguns fighting for the title Joe!” Anyway close fight, COMPLETELY biased commentary, circus of UFC’s Dana White complaining about the decision and the judges (He should return to the ORIGINAL UFC–NO RULES, NO ROUNDS) and in the end you can’t take a champions belt with leg kicks! Lets hope Lyoto Knocks Rua out in the rematch so we won’t have to hear Rogan and Goldberg yelling Shogun like school girls for 5 rounds… Long live the Dragon!!
November 23rd, 2009 at 3:12 am
Great comment by Osmund.I could not help laughing when I saw Shogun fall after hard knee from Machida and they shouted:”Nice take down attempt by Shogun!!!!!”:-)
…..no guys those kicks did not hurt Machida.
The same when Shogun was hit while kicking Machida, they shouted “Ohhhhh waaaaaaaw , great body kick by Shogun, the best and hardest kick
Go Lyoto.
November 23rd, 2009 at 3:19 am
And Dana White and others where eating popcorn, were speaking with their friends, were more observing which girl has bigger boobs than observing the octagon etc.
But referees where watching carefully every second of the fight.
November 23rd, 2009 at 8:01 am
Everybody know Dana´s goal in assert that Machida maybe not won that fight. Another fight against Shogun will be the best UFC event ever made for the public. Think about that, The Last Dragon against Sho-Nuff, the Shogun of Harlem, looks like american movie, mixed up with the greatest legends of MMA. Who, mentally normal and drugged by fight, will not see this fight. No one. Dana, you will be the richest matherfucker man in this world, don’t come with your poor speech tell me that Machida do not won that fight. You just want money.
Now, I think that the Shogun deserves a rematch, he was hard and brave. seems that the fight do not over yet, and, so far, Machida remains the winner. Otherwise, we cannot be so radical. let’s wait and see who is the master.
November 23rd, 2009 at 10:46 am
Yeah KO.PREDICTOR I forgot that one after Machida landed the knee and Rua basically was collapsing on him and Rogan’s ”Nice take down attempt by Shogun!!!!!” And that one punch Rua landed on Lyoto’s neck where Rogan was yelling “Machida got hit Mike, Machida got hit!!– that was the first clean shot we’ve seen Machida take” Bloody hell it landed on his neck as he was falling away! There are too many to recount– Like Lyoto said– “watch the fight on MUTE– you’ll see an entirely different fight!” Cant wait for the rematch…
November 23rd, 2009 at 11:45 am
Yes the rematch, I feel sorry for Shogun now
I think he does not deserve so hard punishment he is going to get from Machida in the remetch 
He is great oponent for sharpening Lyoto’s fighting skills.
Let’s hope it will not be a capital punishment for Shogun
November 23rd, 2009 at 1:19 pm
lyoto clearly beat rua. If there are doubters, the rematch will prove them wrong. GO LYOTO!!!!!!
November 23rd, 2009 at 2:22 pm
One more thought on this– as a few of the comments above here mentioned about Rogan and his hand puppet Goldberg, I was asking myself over and over if these guys are watching the SAME fight!??? In the 4th or 5th round Goldberg is yaking that Shogun has ‘another mouth to feed– his wife is pregnant with a daughter’ blah blah blah while Machida was landing a few nice strikes to Rua’s head– they were too busy fantasizing about Shogun to see what was happening in the Octagon. If any of you saw the Ortiz/Griffin II match Saturday I was saying the same thing again– are they watching the same fight??? In the 3rd round Tito was SO GASSED he could hardly keep his hands up let alone punch Griffin. Yeah he showed alot of heart by not getting KO’d, but that’s only because Forrest is so damn slow!! Yet did you hear even ONE comment about how gassed Tito was??? NO!!! Tito was spent at the end of round 2 and looked pained just standing upright in round 3!– yet Rog-Berg were completely oblivious to the condition of the fighters… Maybe they’re actually playing that UFC PS3 video game….it looks realistic….
November 23rd, 2009 at 3:42 pm
Glad to see a good commentary. I left the fight wondering if my bias for Machida had skewed my judgement of the fight….I felt that Shogun looked to have won as well. Then I read someone’s advice to watch the fight without audio. It was humbling to “experience” a totally different fight. Watching it that way, the author’s observations ring completely true. Lyoto clearly won 3 rounds, arguably won round 4 (though a tie wouldn’t be a surprise) and tied round 5. Shogun was clearly fresher by the end of the fight, and Lyoto’s legs were stiffening up, but Lyoto had the vast majority of hits with a) head shots b) body kicks c) effective knees to body and 4) combinations that drove Shogun into cover-up. Shoguns’ effectiveness was in his a) short right knees to Lyoto’s inner right thigh b) some of his later right kicks to Lyoto’s left thigh–only in rounds 3-5 and c) his endurance. Not trusting to my opinion, I had three other folks who had been convinced of Shogun’s win and they were equally astonished. I guess it goes to show how audio (both commentary and crowd cheers) as well as selective playbacks focusing on Shogun’s few effective hits (one good punch to Lyoto’s neck and a couple of leg shots) really derails the overall reality. A good learning lesson for me! Perhaps the judges should wear noise-cancelling hearing protection!
November 23rd, 2009 at 3:48 pm
Re: Osmund’s comments–every fight Ortiz has fought in the past five years has been preceded with a line such as “Ortiz’s conditioning has never been questioned” followed by a clip of Ortiz training at Big Bear. Ortiz comes in cocky as ever, and by round 2 he’s gassed, visibly slow and getting his ass kicked. I wonder when the myth of Tito’s conditioning will go the way of his octagon success? Rogan ordinarily gives good technical commentary while his idiot “..isn’t that right Joe?” sidekick is a necessary “Pepper” (think ‘Dodgeball’) but sometimes both of these commentators seem plain lost!
November 24th, 2009 at 2:38 pm
I would like to see Anderson Silva Vs Mauricio Rua after this fight….
November 24th, 2009 at 4:26 pm
That would be a good fight for Rua, not sure if you meant before the rematch or after…Anyway thats why Dana White wanted Shogun to win so bad– he knows Anderson Silva will never fight Machida, Thats’ BS to give Rua an immediate rematch, let him work his way back to a title shot like every one else, he lost fair and square to the champ Machida. Rua should fight the Spider, or the winner of the Evans vs. T.Silva fight, or Rampage.
November 26th, 2009 at 8:27 am
thank God someone realized how the announcers saw the figh, one sided.they had rua winning before the fight started i dont know what fight they where waching,but I saw a great champ defend his title.
November 26th, 2009 at 8:51 am
Hey Guys, I can’t find Portugese lyrics for Pregador Luo’s song: Lyoto Machida theme from album Musica de guerra, does anybody know where to find it? Thanks.
November 26th, 2009 at 9:00 pm
@Steve I definitely agree with you!!! Impatient fighters get knocked out. Good fighters don’t just look for openings but react instinctively on the specific occasion. Both of them are good fighters and they just don’t want to be careless…
November 27th, 2009 at 6:39 am
This article speaks the truth
November 27th, 2009 at 8:54 am
I watched the fight with the commentary turned off and I agree that Lyoto won the first 3 rounds clearly. Shogun is one of my fav. fighters, but he landed no combo’s and got no takedowns. His offense was limited to one kick/one knee type of shots, and Lyoto landed some great combo’s and clean strikes in those first 3 rds(Shogun has always had a great chin). The Gun did win the 5th round, and it was a close 4th(though I had Machida edging him out in that rd – could have alomst gone either way) – but it would have been a travesty to award him a victory in that fight. I’ve seen that kind of commentary a few times in the UFC, and it does affect how one views and perceives the action. That being said, Lyoto is an inspirational fighter and person. He has countless fans in the US and around the world. We’ll be giving him all our energy, prayers and support in his next fight. Oh yeah, Lyoto also proved he has an iron chin. Some of the shots he took from Shogun(especially in the 5th) have knocked other great fighters down or out. I was impressed with The Dragon’s will and determination!
November 27th, 2009 at 7:05 pm
well…Machida didn’t blow Rua out, but at the same time…Shogun landed less sginificant blows to machida the whole fight. Sorry guys…Leg kicks don’t win fights…not unless you break their leg…
November 27th, 2009 at 7:06 pm
Furthermore, most real martial artists say Machida won…so…
November 29th, 2009 at 3:00 pm
hey kris didona, they were watching the UFC 2009 Undisputed fight that Cuck lidell and Tito Ortiz were playing. =P
November 30th, 2009 at 11:16 am
I think what many people need to realize is that it is GOOD business for Dana and his people to say that Rua was ripped off and he won the fight.
If Machida destroyed Rua, who does Machida fight next? How many more people are going to order the UFC fight in May vs. this one? MANY more people.
If Rua didn’t fight Machida again, who would he fight? Jackson? No. Rashad Evans again? No. Forrest Griffin? (after getting destroyed by Silva) No.
Who? Who is the logical next person who should fight Machida? Anderson Silva has said he refuses to fight Machida.
November 30th, 2009 at 6:16 pm
I actually thought Shogun won the fight the first time I watched it. I replayed it a second time just to try and see what the judges saw. Machida clearly won the fight. He landed more strikes, blocked more strikes, and was overall the better fighter. Rua was only throwing one punch/kick combos. When Rua did attempt to throw 3 or 4 punch/kick combos Machida blocked them, When Machida threw a combo he had a higher percentage of landing his strikes than that of Rua. I think most people thought Rua won the fight because of the poor commentary by Joe Rogan and Mike Goldberg. Watch the fight a second time if you don’t believe me and turn the commentary off because all it does is brainwash your mind.
December 5th, 2009 at 12:40 pm
I said in this blog that shogun won, but me and my boyfriend were wrong.
December 6th, 2009 at 7:39 pm
I am so glad I found this forum and can see that so many people believe what I believe that Lyoto won the fight fair and square and that sometimes commentary detracts from what is actually going on and can affect people more than what they are seeing. Jo Rogan should report what he sees, not what he thinks. Go Machida, hope you stay champion for a LONG TIME and Awesome fighting style. More people should train like you.
December 7th, 2009 at 7:54 pm
あなた侍….に該当する場合lyota
集中
December 8th, 2009 at 6:09 pm
The thing is, the judges reasoned that they awarded the fight to Machida on the basis that ‘he made Rua come after him’, but the reality is that Shogun is an aggressive type of fighter who comes after his opponents regardless of who they are, whilst Machida just back-peddles. If Rua hadn’t constantly tried to get in Lyoto’s face then there wouldn’t have been a fight, just two men facing each other for 25 minutes.
Neither man put the other in any form of danger, although each did catch the other with some shots. However, it was Shogun who caused obvious damage to Machida with constantly leg kicks and, if I’m not mistaken, wasn’t that exactly how Forrest beat Rampage?
I honestly was not a Shogun fan prior to this fight; I knew very little about him (amazing I know) but after seeing the fight I was confident he would become the new champion. The fact is, fans of each man will see that person as the dominant fighter in such a close fight. People who say Shogun will get absolutely get knocked out in the rematch must be slightly dim in the head as he has never come anywhere close to getting KO’d before. The same goes for Machida – I can’t see him getting finished very easily. I see the second fight also going the distant, although this time I hope there’s a more definite winner.
December 8th, 2009 at 9:39 pm
Lyoto won the fight no doubt. Joe R. is qualified to have a say; dig a bit deeper it goes beyond fear factor. I have been a Machida fan since his second fight (Stephen Bonner)…. Anyone who thinks Rua won was clearly drunk and has know idea what the actual sport of MMA provides and entails! I can not wait for Lyoto to knock his ass down the next fight….. He is the smartest, most patient, best pound for pound fighter MMA has and will see for a long long time! He will study and train and give us what we want, like he has done in recent fights because to actually get respect in the UFC apparently you you have to knock people out rather then win by sheer talent!
December 9th, 2009 at 4:53 am
Looking at the fight again, I was wrong, Machida won, not shougan. It takes a real idiot to stand and blast, if you call leg kicks a blast.
It takes intelligence to move, look at Mayweather.
I was wrong about my earlier comment. I hope this clears it up. I am sorry.
December 12th, 2009 at 5:21 pm
I lost alot of respect for Joe Rogan that night. Does he have a crush on Shogun, or what? Totally onesided commentary, disrespectful, and cheapened his reputation.
December 13th, 2009 at 8:14 am
Thanks for this article, it made me watch it again and I think I was wrong to think that Machida lost it. I really thought Machida lost that fight the first time I saw it, but watching it again, wary of the commentary of Joe and Goldberg, it seems it really was a Machida win, but a very close one indeed.
And to B-Rad, I’m a huge Machida fan but Machida is not the best Pound-for-pound fighter, its Fedor.
December 14th, 2009 at 4:33 pm
Great post! Right on too. Rogan and Goldberg let their man crushes of Rua get in the way of calling a good and gritty fight. If Dana is upset any anyone it should be with those two tools calling the action not the judges.
While I am a big fan of both guys, I was rooting for Lyoto Machida all the way in this one. He is a special fighter that we just do not get the chance to see very often. As for the fight itself, I agree 100%…Rua’s kicks, while affective, were not enough to win the fight. I am not a fighter or a judge but in a Championship fight you have to do more than that to dethrone a Champion like Machida.
I think the rematch is going to be a beat down for Lyoto Machida given Rua already put it all in the octagon in November.
December 16th, 2009 at 12:21 am
During the fight, I became really annoyed by the obnoxious screams from Rogan and Goldberg for any small move Rua did. During the flurries the commentators were quiet and really plain about Machida’s actions and the one hit Rua got Machida with, they cream their pants in excitement. Rua is a really talented fighter in the eyes of many but Machida has shown the his immense strengths in every parts of mma competition and that is why his fight with Rua was unanimous in his favor. Machida is my hero and I believe he is the best light-heavyweight in the world. The rematch will reveal a new level of Machida’s dominance once again.
December 17th, 2009 at 12:25 am
The pretty much sums up what I just saw. I am in the Military and a huge fan of Machida and when I heard that he won by unanimous decision I was very happy. This reaction was quickly followed up by comments like “don’t get too excited, he got killed. I don’t know what the judges were watching.”… I have been trying to watch the fight to see for my own eyes what really happened and I was just now able to. The whole time I was watching I was sitting there saying to myself and outloud (directed to Goldberg and Rogan) what fight are you watching. It seemed that every time Rua threw anything that may have been good had it actually landed, those two would react like Rua had just knoced him out. As perfectly stated in this article, they didn’t say much of anything about Machida’s counters that actually were landing and obviously knocking Rua back. I think what it boils down to is that Machida is so good that to see him get hit a couple times for the first time was a shock in itself because of the fact that no one else has been able to do so. Ok, I’ll give you that. It was shocking to see him get hit, but come on, it’s a fight, people are going to get hit. I guess for someone who doesn’t know anything about fighting and can only base their opinion off of what the announcers are saying, I can see where they would think that Rua was “robbed”, but fortunately for Machida the judges don’t have to listen to Rogan or Goldberg. The fight was close. It was the first close fight that I have seen Machida in, but just because a guy is so good that the world is shocked when he is in a close fight for the first time doesn’t make him lose. I think I’m going to watch the next Machida fight on mute, so I don’t have to listen to what was obviously an attempt to simply keep interest from viewers who don’t understand or appriciate Machida’s elusive style. Machida rocks!!! Keep doing what you’re doing bro and let the ignorant gestures of idiots blow by. You are undefeated, rightfully, and no one can take that from you!
December 18th, 2009 at 4:06 am
Eu vi a luta e me tornei um grande fa de Lyoto. Pois realmente nesta luta utilizou muito mais do que dar chutes e socos. Utilizou sabedoria e inteligência de utilizar os golpes de seu oponente a seu favor. Realmente seria injusto se a vitória fosse de Maurício . Apesar dele ter demonstrado um grande espirito guerreiro, foi insuficiente para derrotar Lyoto. Como sou brasileiro não tinha o meu lutador preferido, pois admiro os dois e por isso falo como uma pessoa neutra. Um abraço, Lyoto.Realmente seu pai fez um Samurai.
December 19th, 2009 at 3:29 pm
I’m sorry Lyoto, but you lost this fight.
Close one, but you did not win. It was clear as day.
December 20th, 2009 at 9:17 am
Machida got hit, Machida got hit, Mike:-))))))
Very funny comment.
But Shogun got hit as well Mike:-)))), much clearer in the first three rounds, in the third round was in danger.
Machida clearly won 3 out of 5 rounds, Shogun was very good, but Lyoto was better.
December 22nd, 2009 at 2:08 pm
I revelled reading it. I require to read more on this issue…I am admiring the time and effort you put in your blog, because it is obviously one great place where I can find lot of reusable info..
December 25th, 2009 at 11:20 am
Lyoto é um dos lutadores mais honrosos que eu já vi lutar. Merece todo o sucesso que conseguir!
Parabéns!
December 25th, 2009 at 6:48 pm
Para aqueles que gostam de Shogun, eu me incluo entre tais, sinto informar que enquanto Lyoto lutava de forma mais categórica, com golpes e contra-golpes cirúrgicos, Shogun lutava para o público e não passou dos chutes nas pernas e ataques errados. Uma prova disso está nos primeiros 3 rounds, quando Lyoto aplicou excelentes sequências. Depois disso a estratégia de Shogum começou a funcionar, quando os chutes passaram a minar a resistência do adversário. Pena que era tarde…
December 27th, 2009 at 7:26 pm
One thing is clear: Both fighters definitely need to fight again to settle the score once and for all. As much as I am a fan of the Dragon, Shogun looked to be the more determined fighter. Lyoto will have his hands full because there are a lot of hungry fighters in the light-heavyweight division. With Couture going down a weight, there are also youngbloods such as Jon Jones and Ryan Bader. Not to mention former champions such as Liddell, Evans and Griffin all eager to get the belt back. I hope he learns from what happened to be a better champion.
December 31st, 2009 at 9:49 am
Machida won a close decision against a healthy motivated Shogun(aside from his pre op fight and the tune up after, Rua has been/is one of the most dominant mixed martial artists in recent history). Machida needed his hand operated on before the fight(decreased punching power)…he had a hard time training with the media and fans demanding attention ect – excuses exuses. Whatever the reason, he didn’t look like the same fighter. Maybe it was purely Shogun’s gameplan that caused Machida’s lackluster performance, but the fact is, while he didn’t win in dominating fashion, he also didn’t get beat in dominating fashion(never was dropped, and was not taken down -mixed it up on the feet well enough that I could see him winning 3 rds on points – it’s not a completely outrageous notion). He also took shots from Shogun that have KO’d or at least knocked down some pretty great fighters from Rua’s past. He showed that if he isn’t elusive enough and gets hit hard, he can take it. Even when he wasn’t looking his best, he still seemed good enough to keep it close with arguably the best LHW from this past decade. He didn’t make Shogun look like an amateur, and everyone was used to seeing him do that to opponents. That’s just not gonna happen with a healthy Shogun. Machida is still way ahead of most of the comp and is still one of the better fighters fighting today…his immediate problem is, so is Shogun. Machida is still in the P4P mix, albeit not nearly as much as before the Shogun fight. If he comes back and schools or KO’s Shogun, his aura(mystique) will be close to what it was. For the record, I don’t think any1 is invincible, but there are a few guys that would probably win 95% of the time and imho Machida is still in that category
December 31st, 2009 at 11:30 pm
I was wondering what happened. After I turned the tv off i didn’t look up all the possible outraged people. I was was frustrated with the commentary that night to the point I muted the sound for a time. Shogun this and Shogun that but no mention of the counter strikes and combinations put together and some blocked strikes by Lyoto. So when the decision what read I was like either the commentators were going to get a mouthful or the judges. Joe Rogan needs to study a bit more and watch the fight more and the models less otherwise I see him being left behind because MMA is going to be monstrous in the next 10 years and we are going to need some class ringside talking professionally about what is happening in the ring and not the after party they are going to attend.
January 2nd, 2010 at 10:07 pm
To be a champ you first have to beat one. Shogun did not do that. Machida stopped about 20 takedowns and that scores points. The stand up was close. You cauld see Silva telling Machida before the fight about them. Thats all Shogun had. Fair fight and will be a lot faster next time. Shogun better practice running backwards cause he’ll need it again.
January 2nd, 2010 at 10:37 pm
Definately lyoto was not dominant like he has bn in his past fights but rua could not have expected to win with leg kicks I respect both fighters and the truth is the challenger has to win convincingly. And I do thing commentating was 1 sided but not to say that rogan & Goldberg were favoriting rua. Definately lyotos counters did affect more than shoguns kicks and the truth is that the only person who was almost finished in that fight was rua in the 3rd round but I’m sure the rematch will end it all may both fighters have a great match.
January 5th, 2010 at 10:51 am
The best and the most thruthfull article !
January 9th, 2010 at 5:21 pm
thanks everyone for these comments — I tried to boycott the UFC after this but alas. I haven’t read everything here but one thing I will add is that even if this had been a one-sided fight, sports-casters should know their place — and it is not their place to disrespect real artists at work. a more neutral, informed, and observant approach would behoove them both, and I for one think Rogan owes Machida an apology for his very disrespectful comments at the end of the fight — because we all know Rogan would not care to face Machida with that disrespect.
January 11th, 2010 at 2:04 pm
BS! If Rua’s leg kicks only struck the legs of Machida, then explain his ribs looking redder than a stop sign. His face looked like it was tenderized with a hammer. When they announced the winner, Machida could barely stand up, looked liked he got his ass kicked, red all over and swollen while Rua looked normal. I actually liked Machida until after this fight. Taking credit for a fight you clearly lost is not admirable and now this bs coming out trying to defend him, or maybe convince him that he won. Machida converted me to a Rua fan.
January 12th, 2010 at 5:10 am
“Jeff”…please educate yourself and observe on YouTube all MMA fights to better aquaint yourself with MMA and what constitutes a win.
1. A champion fighter can take the punishment and still be accurate in his offense and defense. This was clearly seen by Machida’s performance. By your definition, GSP should have lost to Penn with the 1st fight. Fedor should have lost at the last fight too, right? Heck, Griffin should have lost to Bonner too, right? Their faces were pretty bloodied compared to the loser. Your boy Shonun looked just as red in the torso too, Jeff.
2. For fights resulting in non-KO, the judges rely on points, not redness or minor cut-lip factor. Please observe the fight again…you will see that more points were scored by Machida with headshots (kicks, knees, punches). As far as Shonun’s head strikes, I only saw punches, NOTHING MORE!
3. Jeff, you tell me if there was any Shonun defense at the end of the 3rd round where Shonun was a victim of a barrage of Machida strikes (punches, jabs, knee,…heck, even a front kick). Do you recall any similar barrage of strikes by Shonun, Jeff? I guess Shonun’s strategy was to be the next UFC Champion through the back door…meaning via knee kicks, ala Griffin in the Rampage Vs. Griffin fight. Griffin had even done a better job with crippling the opponent with the knee kicks than your boy, Jeff.
3. Enough of this BS…IF SHONUN WANTED TO BE THE MAN AND THE CHAMPION, THEN BE THE MAN AND KNOCK MACHIDA OUT, DAMN IT!!! A little warefare lesson to you Jeff. When you are defending your fort (i.e., Machida DEFENDING his title), you do not allow the enemy to ransack/destroy it (i.e.,knockout). Defending your fort/title does not necessarily mean destroying your enemy, although one would like to do that. Your goal in defense is to protect your own, not be destroyed, and surely, to reduce the offensive potency. Machida DEFENDED his title. The CHALLENGER, Shonun needs to DESTROY the fort BY ALL MEANS NECESSARY and claim the title, NOT by claiming damage to the fort’s walls (Machida’s cut lip and body’s redness) as the reason that you DESERVE the belt. Shameful of Shonun to think that way, shameful for his fans (convert or not) to think that way, shameful for the challenger/fans to think that it is not admirable for the current champion to retain his belt due to the subpar performance by the challenger. What ever happened to the breed of athletes who is only proud to beat the champion in a convincing fashion (KO, submission) and would not accept anything less from himself. Rua should NOT be a proud athlete if he won by decision and gotten the belt in this fashion. Jeff, you would be his fan, but I am sure, not a proud fan. Without being a proud fan Jeff, you will give him up in a heartbeat if Shonun’s future performance will be as lackluster. Jeff, we know you are capable of jumping ship.
BTW Jeff, I am sure Machida is “devastated” to lose a fair-weathered fan such as yourself.
For me, Shogun showed none (Shonun!) to be proud of.
January 13th, 2010 at 6:27 pm
I really hoped that Machida is 100% in the up-coming rematch. I agree with an article I read that whenever he goes up to fight, he not only defends Karate but all traditional martialarts as well. No fighter has utilized the principles and strategies of Karate the way he does.
January 15th, 2010 at 9:18 am
Its not the dog in the fight, its the fight in the dog!! TKD like Karate has gotten a bad rap for sometime. But if the techniques are practiced religously by a dedicated fighter, both are lethal.
January 17th, 2010 at 8:59 pm
LINDO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
QUE DEUS TE PROTEJA EM TODAS SUAS LUTAS !!
XERO .
January 21st, 2010 at 7:31 am
I understand that he shouldnt of won that fight but if you watch the rampage vs forrest fight, where forrest took the belt, you’ll notice forrest didnt do much more than shogun did. Purly leg kicks that yes affected rampage but rampage also landed more punchs and overall more damage to forrest yet forrest won that belt. Maybe this is one of the reasons why people belive Shogun should have won that fight.
January 23rd, 2010 at 12:39 pm
This article keeps taking about the commentators influencing perception, but what about the thousands of people in attendance that overwhelmingly supported Machida at the outset but were booing when the decision was made? Joe Roagan didn’t sway their opinions
January 24th, 2010 at 7:37 am
the decision has been made and it is to late to change things. whether you want to use the stated things such as the commentary, or whether you want quote takedown attempts, these are just aspects of a fight individuals are using for a bias decision to their prefered fighter.
i personally like both rua and lyoto, and unfortunetly when it comes down to a title match, there always has to be one victor, and the deicision was made to lyoto for reasons that the judges feel he was the better fighter on the night.
another example of this reaction is when you see Michael Bisping win a fight, he’s may not be the most popular and nearly always underappreciated, so when he wins the reaction is very similar to this, but the difference is Bisping will finish the fight early leaving a clear victory with no place to argue the decision.
i think the only way this arguement will ever be settled is by the end result of the rematch, via K.O, T.K.O or submission. until then i feel there is no need to follow arguement about “my favourite fighter is better then yours”, but instead enjoy the current up and coming fights, and prepare yourself for the fight of your life in the close future.
January 24th, 2010 at 8:24 am
I think the summary makes a good point. It does seem most MMA fans are easily swayed by what sells many pro sports events more than the performances of the athletes; the emotion filled projected comments of what someone would actually like to see happen instead of what is actually probable or in this case what has actually occurred with regard to the skills of the athletes not the blood shed.
January 27th, 2010 at 9:18 am
Everything has been said here… Only commantators made people think that Shogun was “dominating”… It was close but you, Lyoto Machida, won. I love you Lyoto, I am a 19 French big fan of you from Paris, I practice Shotokan Karate and Judo and I was so happy when you became the new UFC LightHeavyWeight CHAMPION. Cheers Lyoto, continue to train hard, I’m with you.
February 1st, 2010 at 2:53 am
First I think both are great fighters,and arguments over fights that go to the judges in mma, boxing,or anyother fighting competition have and always will be a constant.The people who say joe and mike have somehow brainwashed the tv audience get a life I watch the fight don’t care what joe and mike say they are there for entertainment. Machida does run a lot its ultimate fighting not elusive fighting,he actually has a really good chin karate doesn’t let the show
February 1st, 2010 at 2:55 am
First I think both are great fighters,and arguments over fights that go to the judges in mma, boxing,or anyother fighting competition have and always will be a constant.The people who say joe and mike have somehow brainwashed the tv audience get a life I watch the fight don’t care what joe and mike say they are there for entertainment. Machida does run a lot its ultimate fighting not elusive fighting,he actually has a really good chin karate doesn’t let that show
February 1st, 2010 at 3:22 am
Ok this if off subject but is anyone else think that machida should have some respect for the real DRAGON there was only one yeah that’s right MASTER Bruce Lee the one and only DRAGON if you want to pay tribute machida get a tattoo or buy a poster,you calling yourself the dragon is disrespectful. And does anyone know if chuck liddel calls himself iceman because of the comics,or the mob hitman who actually killed people and froze the bodies so time of death would be hard for cops. Or does he dream of tom cruise coming to his rescue like in topgun, save me maverick im iceman
February 2nd, 2010 at 5:51 pm
I am not Japanese, but I believe “Lyoto” means “dragon” in the Japanese language. Bruce Lee was born during the year of the dragon according to the Chinese calendar. Good point about the dragon and iceman thing, fightfan. I guess now, there is only one “Chinese Dragon” and only “Japanese Dragon.” LOL
February 2nd, 2010 at 5:55 pm
typo: …and only one “Japanese Dragon.” LOL
February 3rd, 2010 at 7:17 pm
Bruce was born in the year of the dragon 1940 but also in the hour of the dragon I think is 7 or 8 am.If lyoto means dragon then his name is dragon the dragon machida?
February 4th, 2010 at 7:14 pm
I think I t was a close fight but Shogun should have won that fight “But I like you as a fighter a lot more” shogun he pushed the pace and landed strikes more. I hope in the next fight you have with Shogun you will by KO so it does not go to the scoroe cards
February 5th, 2010 at 9:25 pm
It was a really close fight. I do not think Shogun dominated it nor did Machida. Everybody is saying that Machida countered Shogun’s kicks. Well, he countered but if you watch the fight in slo-mo when the exchanges occurred you will clearly see that most of Machida’s counters did not cleanly land, or outright missed Shogun’s head and face. So, Machida countered but he missed the target too many times. The real damage Machida inflicted were the devastating knees to the ribs/abdomen area. I thought Shogun was going to collapse when he ate the first one. That is where all the real damage occurred, not in the counter-punches. Machida did land one good punch to the chin of Shogun when Shogun ran and did a jumping kick to Lyoto’s body. When Lyoto got Shogun backed against the cage and both fighters were firing at each other, all of Lyoto’s punches missed Shogun and Shogun landed a good hook to Lyoto’s head. Shogun went for the takedowns, Lyoto didn’t. Personally, I believe Shogun should have squeaked out the decision. In terms of damage, Shogun severely damaged Lyoto’s legs and Lyoto seemed to have crushed Shogun’s ribs with the knees. In fact, when the fight was over, Shogun’s cornerman grabbed Shogun around his torso and lifted him to celebrate and you could clearly see a distressed, painful expression on Shogun’s face. That particular cornerman though very happy at that moment, not a very intelligent guy. Ignorance is bliss. All in all all, if you review the exchanges in slo-mo you will see that Shogun landed more punches than Lyoto as well as great kicks, attempted takedowns while Lyoto punished Shogun’s ribs, got one good punch to the chin and had a quicker start to the fight. Sorry, decision should have gone to Shogun. But, Shogun and Lyoto are both awesome fighters, the best in the world and that is why it was the fight that it was.
February 12th, 2010 at 12:29 pm
I love this fight and these fighters. Too bad that their fans often can’t appreciate the other fighter or have enough respect to see that the fight was amazingly close, that the judges had a really difficult fight to score, and that their decision was valid.
Fight fans aren’t usually 10 point must fans. However, you can’t fault Machida for fighting within the rules criteria more effectively even though if you judged the fight overall, or if the fight had gone on more rounds the fight could well have gone to Shogun.
As for the announcers, sports announcers are one step up from parrots, except for Mike Goldberg who will never hold up to a bird as intelligent as a parrot.
As for all the fighters who saw the fight and thought Machida lost… well, these are guys who are not well versed in point fighting. Since Shogun never put Machida in danger, and had his takedown attempts shut down the fight was scored on points. Machida was a champion point fighter at an age younger than most fighters started training martial arts.
Fortunately the fight was close and so many people were dissatisfied with the result that we get to see 2 of the most skilled and talented fighters mix it up again. The UFC should have a yearly Machida vs. Shogun fight just so people can keep seeing actual technique in action.
February 15th, 2010 at 3:52 am
Machida won 3:2, the second round was the closest but Machida got it by hard body knees, Shogun covered being hurt by fake takedown “attempts”
,
)))))
“Nice take down attempt by Shogun, good timing”
UFC rounds are scored separately, Machida won 3:2.
February 16th, 2010 at 11:26 pm
I’m not a fan of either fighter and I totally agree with this article. I have noticed that Rogan and Goldberg usually do this in every big fight; they pick and watch only one fighter. I warned the 6 people that I watched the fight with that these commentators would be biased toward one fighter, i just didn’t know who until about 30 seconds into the 1st round. I was the only one out of 7 of us that thought Machida won the fight. I couldn’t believe it, I made the same guys watch the fight again the next weekend without the sound, and all but 1 person changed their pick and said Machida won the fight. Rua didn’t land two punches the whole fight. Machida won 3 rounds and possibly round 5.
Watch the fight again without sound and no doubt you will see that Machida wins. Also, watch it with sound, late in the 5th round, Machida lands a huge knee that snaps Rua’s head and neck back; it totally stopped him in his tracks, and unbelievably, neither commentator said a thing.
Rogan sucks, and Goldberg kisses Rogans ass. Rogan needs to go back to queer factor where he fits in better.
February 18th, 2010 at 4:28 am
But Shogun had very nice FFFFFFFake down attempts
February 18th, 2010 at 9:28 am
Can’t analyze it any better, Zatch. The rest of you Rua “voters” are absolute morons. Just frickin’ stupid. Watch the fight again, turn off the sound, and mental clarity is the result. In the rematch, Rua will lose decisively. The only one who can beat Machida is Anderson Silva, because he can move just as deftly.
February 18th, 2010 at 12:03 pm
I am a student of the Korean karate, Tang Soo Do (TSD). Although I do not have a black-belt, I have studied for many years and have trained in other martial art styles.
I would like to follow up the minority of the dissenters on the comments to this article; in particular, agreeing analytically with “Michael” [February 5th] and “unbiased person” [November 24th @ "Machida Edges Rua by Close Decision," posted on this site].
Before I begin my Reply, I would like to say, though, that I take exception to “unbiased person’s” more rhetorical criticism’s of karate and Lyoto. First, the UFC is designed to be sport, not “cockfighting.” I am sure there are a lot, if not the majority of fans who want to see the fighters pound each other relentlessly; and Lyoto’s defensive style has been called boring, inactive, etc.
However, the fighter’s are professionals and there are rules to be observed. If you don’t care for Lyoto’s style, that is a personal choice, not necessarily a judging critera. In my view, Lyoto’s style accomplishes three very important MMA sport goals: (1) safety, injury avoidance to himself and his opponent, (2) a strategy of presenting a very difficult defense against the opponent, (3) compliance with UFC rules. From a professional perspective, one should commend Lyoto’s style. I feel strongly that his opponent in the last fight, Shogun Rua, should also be commended as a professional and a sportsman.
“Unbiased person” also criticizes karate people who have experience as thinking they are THE JUDGE. Those with experience in the marital arts, as is “unbiased person,” have the training and experience, the basis to understand the competency shown by a karate fighter. Karate practitioners can be biased or mistaken in their judgement, because people in general can be biased or mistaken. They are not a ’special case.’ After all, this a Lyoto Machida website.
Some of the typical MMA comentator / trainer comments about Lyoto show how biased or mistaken they are as well, because they lack a good grounding in traditional martial arts. They use broad descriptive terms that Lyoto is displaying in his fights, like ‘elusive’ and ‘defensive’ and ‘timing,’ that indicate little knowlege of what underlying abilites are gained or what training is involved in karate. When Lyoto started in the UFC, some said his defensive nature indicated he lacked confidence. Personally, I don’t think Lyoto ever lacked confidence–what is true is that there is no guarantee you are going to win every fight. My background in TSD, which shares many similarities to Machida (Shotokan) karate, gives me a factual basis to appraise marital arts fighting.
My short appraisal of both fighters, Lyoto Machida [Machida (Shotokan) Karate] and Shogun Rua [Muay Thai] is:
Lyoto Machida exemplifies the abilities conferred by traditional martial arts training, his case a Shotokan Karate base. It is Lyoto’s Shotokan Karate and skill level of black-belt competition champion that enables him to routinely defeat most sport-based MMA fighters. Lyoto’s sound karate base also makes him a consistenly good fighter.
Shogun Rua is one of the all-time top LHW MMA fighters in the world. He is a highly skilled Muay Thai figher which makes him a very versatile and effective striker.
What sets Shogun apart from most MMA fighters is his tactical ability to see as well as create openings, decisively counterattack, and to strike to multiple zones of the body with Muay Thai weapons (feet, elbows, fists, knees). Shogun has excellent training, but he does not display the consistency of Lyoto.
In terms of stratey, Lyoto [and Shotokan] have a defensive philosophy; Shogun and his Muay Thai base is more offensive in character. I think this is one reason why Shogun did so well against Lyoto @ UFC 104. However, I believe the better story on strategy is that Lyoto who is a defensive person, using a defensive strategy AND is holding back, is not a good approach against and aggressive world-class fighter, Shogun. I also feel Shogun was holding back, presumably both on instruction from the UFC.
There is a lot of controversy onver UFC 104; Machida vs. Rua outcome. My reading is this:
On a purely technical basis, I give a vote of 30% to Lyoto as a winner. I later read on the internet an accounting of the decision BY UFC RULE that does, strictly speaking, confirm the judges’ decision for Lyoto. In support, I think Lyoto was very accurate in his strikes and was successful in defending against Shogun in the majority of times.
On an overall basis, I give a vote of 30% for a tie. In my broad view, neither Lyoto or Shogun did enough to justify a decisive win. I felt, like most observers, that Shogun took the offensive and did better in striking; yet Lyoto stymied or stalled out much of what Shogun attempted. Lyoto, on the other hand, was too passive in the face of Shogun’s offense, and clearly he took too many hits from Shogun to give Lyoto a winning score on his defense-heavy strategy. I also read an analysis of the techniques applied by the fighters, awarding Shogun the as the more prolific–I concur.
Not strictly going by UFC rules, looking at the bout as a full contact fight, I vote 40% for Shogun as winner. The reason is that Shogun pressed the action; and while Lyoto defended well, Shogun kept Lyoto on the defensive most of the fight. While it is possible to win a fight on the defensive, certainly Shogun’s ability to continue was never compromised by Lyoto’s defense. Secondly, the technique analysis I cited above details that Shogun was in fact, effective against Lyoto, including the strikes.
I think a fair outcome to Shogun would have been for the judges to ‘bend’ the strict reading of the UFC rules and call a draw. In my opinion, neither fighter distinquished themselves. And although one could state Lyoto won technically, Shogun’s full-contact fighting performance was somewhat better overall versus Lyoto’s trademark karate style that night.
I believe an innovative Karate Champion like Lyoto has the potential to defeat a Championship-calibre MMA fighter like Shogun. When Shogun is prepared and at his world-class best, however, Lyoto had better be ramping up to 100% full power in both karate strategy and tactics against the honed-aggression and versatility of Shogun’s Muay Thai.
In closing, it is true that karate (Shotokan) and Lyoto have a defensive philosopy. At the same time and within that philosopy, karate does provide offensive strategy, tactics and techniques. Shogun’s camp should not overestimate Shogun’s aggressive Muay Thai style and underestimate Lyoto’s and karate’s capability to launch a devastating offense, should he so choose.
March 6th, 2010 at 6:07 pm
Machida -vs- Rua II hopefully will shut up either side… this is what happens when it goes to the judges. Someone will have to finish the other in Machida -vs- Rua II or I’m afraid this ongoing, “Machida won… no Rua won…” will go on and on. You have five rounds to finish your opponent in a championship mach. So come one finish the fight and shut every one up!
March 7th, 2010 at 12:17 am
Lyoto “The dragon” is the future of MMA and simply the best in the world (even better than anderson silva}